14 replies to this topic

[Zildjian1129]

Does anyone what cymbals John used when he was in The Doors?

[onemat]

Does anyone what cymbals John used when he was in The Doors?

It's funny you asked. This very morning on the way in to work, I had "Morrison Hotel" on and noticed on "Indian Summer" John uses a riveted cymbal, what we used to call a "Sizzle Ride". I thought of asking the same question, what kind of cymbals John? I'm guessing Zildijians, which in the sixties and early seventies were used more in the US then Paiste or anything else. Hopefully John will see this and post something. I'm also interested in what gear he's using now.
I remember John saying in the book that he and/or the studio engineer spent a lot of time on his drums, and I think it is very evident on all the recordings. His toms are muffled but still have more tone then many drummers of the period.  He is a very musical sounding drummer, something that has affected my approach to the drums too. It's funny how much I still notice and discover about what John and the rest of the band did musically, even though I had worn out my Lps years ago and now am adding the Doors to my CD collection. I'm still listening.
On the tune "We Could Be So Good Together" did you ever notice the little thing puts in his solo. It's a very famous piece of music..I know I have it, but can't remember what it is. I think it's Monk. It goes: Ba-Da-Be-Da Dot,  Da-Be-Da Dot-Da. It's on the tip of my fingers as I type this, but I can't remember what it is. Got to go through my Monk and Miles records to find it.
Matt

[knowidea]

Hmmm, I always thought the Paiste cymbals were more popular during that time period?   I know very well the part you are talking about OneMatt on "We Could Be So Good Together".  You can barely hear someone mimicking (left channel I believe) Ray's little keyboard riff.
  It is very obvious that care was given in the studio recordings for that time period.  The clarity is pretty impressive.
  I'm actually interested in listening to the 5.1 mixdowns of a few songs they have released (Love, death, travel).  I went out and got a 5.1 (SACD) setup hoping this will be a popular format.  I'm hoping it won't find the same demise as the quadraphonic era everyone got excited about (well 5 people got excited about anyway).
Jim

[onemat]

Hmmm, I always thought the Paiste cymbals were more popular during that time period?   I know very well the part you are talking about OneMatt on "We Could Be So Good Together".  You can barely hear someone mimicking (left channel I believe) Ray's little keyboard riff.
  It is very obvious that care was given in the studio recordings for that time period.  The clarity is pretty impressive.
  I'm actually interested in listening to the 5.1 mixdowns of a few songs they have released (Love, death, travel).  I went out and got a 5.1 (SACD) setup hoping this will be a popular format.  I'm hoping it won't find the same demise as the quadraphonic era everyone got excited about (well 5 people got excited about anyway).
Jim

In the days of the sixties and seventies in the US, Zildjian was far more common to see in the shops; especially big heavy 20" Rides, 18" Crashes and 14" hats. In the late fifties and into the early sixties, Paiste marketed in-expensive cymbals with the Ludwig name on them in the US and elswhere. Drummers from the UK and other places in Europe were into Paiste long before they took hold here. The first American Drummer I remember going all Paiste was Doug Clifford of CCR including some huge 16" Hi-Hats.
Paistie's most famous rock drummers undoubtably would be John Bonham and Ian Paice.
I think all the major players in the cymbal world have great stuff. I mix and match although I'm pretty much a Zildjian guy. I can't afford new Paistes anyway!
RE the 5.1 Mixdows. I've ignored them. I like my  older favorite music in 2 channel stereo and in some cases MONO. Early records originally marketed in mono always sound weird to me when re-mixed to stereo with a few exceptions. I can dig early Beatles stuff in Mono or the original stereo mixes. The early Stones, James Brown and many others sound much better to me in glorious MONO! The worst sounding stuff in stereo is the early Elvis material which was originally mono. RCA's Steve Shoals must've been deaf. Those Stereo Re-mixes sounded like crap, especially when they are broadcast on the radio.  
I grew up on the sound of AM radio and old Jukeboxes, still love the old mono tube sound so I'm not about to invest in 5.1. To each his own though!  Now I wouldn't mind hearing "Darkside" or "Meddle" in 5.1 with a big old joint at hand. Oops! I don't do that anymore!  Matt

[knowidea]

And they just so happen to have the whole album "Darkside of the Moon" by Pink Floyd in SACD.   I'm planning on getting that along with Miles Davis "Kind of Blue" also in SACD.   Well you do sound like a sound purist Matt and I can appreciate that.
Jim

[onemat]

And they just so happen to have the whole album "Darkside of the Moon" by Pink Floyd in SACD.   I'm planning on getting that along with Miles Davis "Kind of Blue" also in SACD.   Well you do sound like a sound purist Matt and I can appreciate that.
Jim

I don't know about "sound purist" but as a kid I worked in radio, and lots of AM. Some of the more hip engineers were always experimenting with compression, echo and other stuff. It was amazing how good they could get AM to sound in those days.
As John mentoned earlier, music was not recorded with click tracks and the music breathed more.
A few years ago I was playing in a blues based band, and the bass player and I didn't get along. He was a Republican working for Bush, so we had an instant dislike for each other. We had a really good Japanese guitarist in the band and the other guys would say really mean stuff about him behind his back. This bass player decided my time wasn't right. Even though he insisted in counting off all the tunes. He tended to count things slower than what was expected and then he would accuse me of dragging. He even threatened the old BPM click machine, I said bring it on. As I expected I played right where he counted off and he tended to rush. He was told to shut the hell up! That was my first experience with working with really difficult people in a band situation. I hung in for 11 months (no 29 days) and finally left. I was constantly weighing my love for of the music we were doing, the good crowds we had and my hate for the vibe in the band.  In the last four years I haven't had a real strong musical situation..it's kind of frustrating. Sorry for venting here...
Matt

[knowidea]

I did the garage (or more descriptive basement) band thing a long time ago.  Our problem was we all had OCD perfectionist tendencies, so we never thought we were good enough -hence we never got out of the basement.  I listen to the tapes now and think.....damn we weren't that bad.
  However the biggest problem was we weren't even out of the basement and half the guys could have been featured on the E True Hollywood Story for drug use.  
Jim

[mod orange]

I am not sure about all the albums, but I thought John used Paiste formula 602's. Ludwig was the US supplier for Paiste cymbals and John(for the most part) used Ludwig drums. I must say though, on the live stuff that has been released, his cymbals sound like A zildjians to me. John??

[onemat]

On the tune "We Could Be So Good Together" did you ever notice the little thing puts in his solo. It's a very famous piece of music..I know I have it, but can't remember what it is. I think it's Monk. It goes: Ba-Da-Be-Da Dot,  Da-Be-Da Dot-Da. It's on the tip of my fingers as I type this, but I can't remember what it is. Got to go through my Monk and Miles records to find it.
Matt

Hey All, I remembered the tune, it's "Straight, No Chaser".  
Matt

[rotaryperception]

“When people ask me about the spectrum of this album, I say what kind of fu**ing ass kickin’ do you want?  Right in the nose?  One in the gut, maybe? Or how ‘bout the Chinese fu**ing torture treatment?  It’s all fu**in’ there.  This gave us the opportunity to do something fresh and diverse and bring it to our loyal and die hard fans.  Why paint the same fu**ing picture 15 million times?” --Dimebag



  Vinnie Paul (Pantera, Damageplan)   Brand     SABIAN
  Ride   22" Hand Hammered Power Bell Ride
  Hi-Hat    14" AA Rock Hats
  Crash 1    18" AA Rock Crash
  Crash 2   19" AA Rock Crash
  Splash   12" Ice Bell
  Chinese    20" AA Chinese

[knowidea]

Who the hell is Dimebag?  Sounds like he learned one attributive adjective in school....fu&&king.

[jim4371]

Who the hell is Dimebag?  Sounds like he learned one attributive adjective in school....fu&&king.

Late guitarist of Pantera/Damageplan.
Probably heard of him, shot onstage.

[rotaryperception]

Video of Dimebag At Age 18 playing guitar
Dimebag was so good they would only allow him to be a judge at talent contests in Texas when he was a kid after he won them all.
His brother is Vinnie Paul on drums.
I would say he is better than Robby Krieger. He invented the modern form of metal guitar.

[knowidea]

Yep, heard of Pantera.   Shot on stage........senseless.    You know....now that you mention it - I do indeed remember hearing something about that a few years ago.  Unbelievable.

[elshaman]

Does anyone what cymbals John used when he was in The Doors?

im wondering the same thing...